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Premiership Debate

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donnyladinsheffield View Drop Down
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    Posted: 18 hours 13 minutes ago at 20:25
Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by donnyladinsheffield donnyladinsheffield wrote:

14 teams and ringfenced. Unless they expand end of season playoffs (with issues arising then on numbers of games for players) that will be an awful lot of dead rubbers in a season.


I have said it before, why change anything after a season like this one where almost every game on the last day of the season had something riding on it.

The threat of relegation keeps clubs on their toes - I suspect it is because there was a chance the mighty Leicester were almost relegated that this topic became a hot potato.

It's not broke so don't try to fix it!



To be fair, Leicester have been continuously vocal in their support for promotion and relegation.


Tellingly, so are players who have been through it
Lord have mercy on me; keep me away from Leeds: I've been before; it's not what I'm looking for
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gerg_861 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 hours 17 minutes ago at 20:21
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by donnyladinsheffield donnyladinsheffield wrote:

14 teams and ringfenced. Unless they expand end of season playoffs (with issues arising then on numbers of games for players) that will be an awful lot of dead rubbers in a season.


I have said it before, why change anything after a season like this one where almost every game on the last day of the season had something riding on it.

The threat of relegation keeps clubs on their toes - I suspect it is because there was a chance the mighty Leicester were almost relegated that this topic became a hot potato.

It's not broke so don't try to fix it!



To be fair, Leicester have been continuously vocal in their support for promotion and relegation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 hours 8 minutes ago at 19:30
Originally posted by donnyladinsheffield donnyladinsheffield wrote:

14 teams and ringfenced. Unless they expand end of season playoffs (with issues arising then on numbers of games for players) that will be an awful lot of dead rubbers in a season.


I have said it before, why change anything after a season like this one where almost every game on the last day of the season had something riding on it.

The threat of relegation keeps clubs on their toes - I suspect it is because there was a chance the mighty Leicester were almost relegated that this topic became a hot potato.

It's not broke so don't try to fix it!

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donnyladinsheffield View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote donnyladinsheffield Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 hours 43 minutes ago at 18:55
14 teams and ringfenced. Unless they expand end of season playoffs (with issues arising then on numbers of games for players) that will be an awful lot of dead rubbers in a season.
Lord have mercy on me; keep me away from Leeds: I've been before; it's not what I'm looking for
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Runitback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 11:49
I think that is a superb solution Camquin, but a 14 team Championship . .with no cup comp would make sense and a big yes to Nat1 North and South . . . although North might have to stretch down to Bedfordshire!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 10:37
I suspect we will see a 14 team premiership with no cup. makes much more sense.
Not sure what will happen to academies.
I suspect they would sanction a 14th.

A 16 team combined Championship and Nat 1 with much reduced funding. ~£250k
A promotion play-off weighted in favour of the favoured clique.
3up / 3 down to a renamed national 1 North / South.

16 team Regional Premierships.

Given all the woes on travel, it would make sense to widen the pyramid, but aside from removing National 1, they won't.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote islander Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 10:04
Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

Line from a Times article today, most of which focused on yet more cutbacks at all levels at HQ...

"The RFU Board discussed PRL's latest proposal [yesterday] for a 13-team Prem and the intro of a prom/rel PO. The plan is said to need more work before it is ready to present to the RFU Council for approval in June."


The 'more work' referred to by The Times was expanded upon in The Rugby Paper yesterday. They referred to player welfare concerns, with a 13-team Prem potentially leading to players having an increased workload because of the league season expanding from 22 to 24 games, and issues with the Rugby Players Association about the impact on their members.

Apparently these concerns 'may scupper' the plans to expand to 13 in 2020, with time running out for a decision - which has to be made prior to RFU Council mtg on 14/6. Dumping the Prem Cup was mentioned as one possible solution to the issue - I expect they'll find a way...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonDee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 09:28
Originally posted by Pappashanga Pappashanga wrote:

So I’ll be part time below the Premiership and they will be safe in their cocoon.
 
Possibly and they will keep buying Southern Hemisphere  seconds and nationalizing them after 3 years until they end up like Football where the Premiership only have 30% of English  players in fact the top 6 now have 20% English players in their teams !!!!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pappashanga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 09:00
So I’ll be part time below the Premiership and they will be safe in their cocoon.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonDee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 08:58
Originally posted by billesleyexile billesleyexile wrote:

Originally posted by JonDee JonDee wrote:

One more year of guaranteed funding for the Championship and then 

1) a renegotiation and all continues for the next few years am sure some agreement to change automatic     promotion would be built in 

2) premiership inspired nuclear option and funding is cut and ringfencing brought in with a lifeline to the       relegated premiership team. Can see 3/4 teams surviving but having to cut  their cloth accordingly           but who would they play


Logically, the second option would see anyone still standing in the Championship following the withdrawal of funding if loads of clubs went to the wall having to join N1.
In reality i’m not sure it would be as few as 3/4 though?
 
I think 3/4 teams would have the finance to survive losing the RFU money without altering their team but their problem would be who would they play. I think at least 5/6 teams would have to say goodbye to at least 50% of their squad which would lead to some major mismatches.  100 points plus would not be unrealistic .

The clubs wouldn't have to go to the wall as most players contracts finish at the end of the next season but if they were amalgamated with N1 there would have to be a major reorganisation of the leagues as cannot see N1 suddenly having 20 + teams
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote billesleyexile Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 08:14
Originally posted by JonDee JonDee wrote:

One more year of guaranteed funding for the Championship and then 

1) a renegotiation and all continues for the next few years am sure some agreement to change automatic     promotion would be built in 

2) premiership inspired nuclear option and funding is cut and ringfencing brought in with a lifeline to the       relegated premiership team. Can see 3/4 teams surviving but having to cut  their cloth accordingly           but who would they play


Logically, the second option would see anyone still standing in the Championship following the withdrawal of funding if loads of clubs went to the wall having to join N1.
In reality i’m not sure it would be as few as 3/4 though?


Edited by billesleyexile - Yesterday at 08:15
keep the faith
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trailfinder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2019 at 20:24
Indeed
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonDee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2019 at 19:46
Originally posted by Trailfinder Trailfinder wrote:

Was reading in the Sunday Times today about the RFU cuts to Dean Ryan's department and the reasons for him leaving for the Dragons. Made me think that it's only a matter of time before the RFU go for the 'low hanging fruit' of the Championship funding...
 

I refer to my comment 2 above yours its one of two options 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trailfinder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2019 at 17:18
Was reading in the Sunday Times today about the RFU cuts to Dean Ryan's department and the reasons for him leaving for the Dragons. Made me think that it's only a matter of time before the RFU go for the 'low hanging fruit' of the Championship funding...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote No 7 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 May 2019 at 14:57
I went to the Wasps Harlequins match at the Ricoh Arena. It was literally half full .The official attendance was 16,000 with a capacity of 32,000.

It emphasised the gulf between the Premiership and the Championship in so many ways. The crowd attendance being the most obvious but the standard of play and particurly the defence and pace of the game.

The internationals in both teams both past and present equated to fifty percent of the players on show. The salary value into several millions between the two teams.
Ambition should be made of sterner stuff.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonDee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2019 at 14:45
One more year of guaranteed funding for the Championship and then 

1) a renegotiation and all continues for the next few years am sure some agreement to change automatic     promotion would be built in 

2) premiership inspired nuclear option and funding is cut and ringfencing brought in with a lifeline to the       relegated premiership team. Can see 3/4 teams surviving but having to cut  their cloth accordingly           but who would they play
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marigold Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2019 at 13:40
Championship payments guaranteed for one more season-will be very interesting after that though
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2019 at 09:03
Whilst there has been derision that the Premiership payments are exempt from the cuts (including the new extra requirements) there has been no mention that payments to the Championship teams are also exempt.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2019 at 19:20
Nurse the screens the patient is obviously delusional. He seems to believe the world is rational.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MalMundy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2019 at 14:52

Nothing will ever happen until the RFU has the balls to say to the Premiership Rugby that they have to end their practise of P shares, money from the RFU/Television and other sponsorship of the Premiership should be shared between all Premiership clubs equally.

Not given as a parachute payment to the demoted club. Then if the promoted club from the Championship manages to survive that first season it would be in a better position to push on.

I don’t go for the idea that the parachute payment is a form of insurance that is there to cover players wages etc. if professional clubs can’t run within budgets then tough on them, players and other staff will move on to clubs that can.

Make the Premiership 14 teams and the championship 16 teams do away with the cup competitions and have 2 promoted and 2 relegated also 2 promoted and 2 relegated between Nat 1 and Championship.

Do away with Premiership A league and restrict size of squads, say 36 to 40 for Premiership and 30 to 36 for the Championship (exceptions would be made in cases of injuries), central contracts for England players so clubs can budget and recruit appropriately.

I would also have the championship teams employ a few people to oversee the affairs of the championship (TV/Sponsorship Deals)

NO TO RINGFENCING This destroys competition and ambition (look at the excitement in both leagues this season)

We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time
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