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Salary cap article

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BFG1 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BFG1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Apr 2020 at 21:51
Think major issue is the fact Chinnor and others haven’t kept to the current cap. Why now would they keep to it? It must include all benefits of kind which some clubs that are proposing the cap haven’t. 
NCA couldn’t police current cap so no chance could police £150k cap 
It shouts to me now we don’t have loads of money we want everyone to spend the same! 

Leave the cap as is. It’s not a target you must spend. No different to 70mph speed limit. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Apr 2020 at 22:23
Originally posted by BFG1 BFG1 wrote:

Think major issue is the fact Chinnor and others haven’t kept to the current cap. Why now would they keep to it? It must include all benefits of kind which some clubs that are proposing the cap haven’t. 
NCA couldn’t police current cap so no chance could police £150k cap 
It shouts to me now we don’t have loads of money we want everyone to spend the same! 

Leave the cap as is. It’s not a target you must spend. No different to 70mph speed limit. 




Totally agree as I have already said
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SKalpy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Apr 2020 at 23:19
But there is no salary cap. The RFU regs say that if you spend money on players then you have to declare how much. If it is over a prescribed amount for the level you are playing in then you will lose all RFU funding.

So, in level 3, I believe that amount is £250K. If you declare that your club has spent more than that amount then you are no longer eligible for travel funding (for the peanuts what that is worth) access to RFU loans and grants, subsidised referees fees and the international ticket allocation. If your club wishes to progress beyond level 3 then I suspect you will be paying way over this amount.

However, if your club does not have access to this amount of money, you do not spend it. Clubs may well have to adjust their aspirations because of the situation we are all in but that is their choice. 

Why should one club who foresees a problem suggest to other clubs that 'we are in the smelly brown stuff lads because we only have one major sponsor so you all have to spend less even if you have ten sponsors and it won't affect you as much'?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 00:22
Spend what you’ve got and if you get relegated then so what?

It’s rugby at level 3/4 and to be spending £250k on it is just utter absurdity 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BFG1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 08:11
You are right about lack of funding of over 250k but I bet said clubs who went over that didn’t declare it...

Seen Cambridge and DMP have an article in rugby paper on this as well 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rabbie Burns Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 09:49
Just read TRP article and intuit amazing that a cut and draconian points deductions is being driven by 2 of the worst offenders of manipulating the system it’s almost laughable well done Richie Williams and Gary Law for saying it as it is. Know the Blackheath ex pres has also gone in print about the absurdity of this proposal. There will obviously have to be changes for next season when it eventually gets underway and I think most players are sensible enough to realise that but I see no need to reset everything to suit 2 clubs who have never played on the level playing field
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Pappashanga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 10:50
Having just read the TRP article, I do agree that the proposal to scrap the current N1 salary cap is not driven by anything but self interest. A cap means 'up to' a certain amount. It is, as pointed out by numerous correspondents, a limit rather than a target.If clubs have less money, spend less. No one is making clubs import expensive players. If that means reduced performance, then that performance is all that club can sustain. We're talking relatively small sums of money for running a business here, after all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DGS Old Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 10:55
Originally posted by BFG1 BFG1 wrote:

Think major issue is the fact Chinnor and others haven’t kept to the current cap. Why now would they keep to it? It must include all benefits of kind which some clubs that are proposing the cap haven’t. 
NCA couldn’t police current cap so no chance could police £150k cap 
It shouts to me now we don’t have loads of money we want everyone to spend the same! 

Leave the cap as is. It’s not a target you must spend. No different to 70mph speed limit. 



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Fully agree BFG1, 

I'm under the impression that its only two clubs who have suggested this change is it because they are running out of money and are losing players to other clubs?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pappashanga Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 12:50
Could be right!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 14:15
In recent years a number of clubs have had budgets way in excess of £250k when playing in N2 - if you think they reduced their budget when they were promoted to N1 you are away with the fairies.

I agree, it is a desperate attempt by clubs who suddenly cannot spend the amount they used to and knowing a lot of the players are with them for the money rather club loyalty rightly fear a drain of players to those who will pay
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jester10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 16:52
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

In recent years a number of clubs have had budgets way in excess of £250k when playing in N2 - if you think they reduced their budget when they were promoted to N1 you are away with the fairies.

I agree, it is a desperate attempt by clubs who suddenly cannot spend the amount they used to and knowing a lot of the players are with them for the money rather club loyalty rightly fear a drain of players to those who will pay

Spot on! I remember talking to a Member at a club Rams were visiting and he commented on how he didn't know any of his team anymore, they weren't even seen at the club other than on a Saturday. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 17:50
Originally posted by Jester10 Jester10 wrote:

Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

In recent years a number of clubs have had budgets way in excess of £250k when playing in N2 - if you think they reduced their budget when they were promoted to N1 you are away with the fairies.

I agree, it is a desperate attempt by clubs who suddenly cannot spend the amount they used to and knowing a lot of the players are with them for the money rather club loyalty rightly fear a drain of players to those who will pay


Spot on! I remember talking to a Member at a club Rams were visiting and he commented on how he didn't know any of his team anymore, they weren't even seen at the club other than on a Saturday. 


That as may be however, before Clive N replies, Rams were not one of the teams that sprang to mind when I posted.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 22:56
I guess the cap does not apply to the relegated Championship club?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 23:27
I believe it does. 
But the only penalty is loss of travel funds and the subsidy on referees.

Mind you YC officially had a budget of under £1m with £600k of that allocated to the Rugby Dept. for last season.
That was with £600k of central funding.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Runitback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2020 at 07:18
I think YC had a budget considerably less than £1m  . . . probably nearer the £600k, I dont expect people to be rushing into fund them!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2020 at 08:06
Ah ok, that makes sense. 

In that case a reduction would only benefit a wealthy club. Take money away from the poorer ones and the rich ones could afford to swallow the travel expenditure.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Falcon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 08:54
So this will I assure you be my second and last post on rolling maul

It is clear that almost all of you who have posted did not read my lengthy note

Let me distill it for you

Uk and the whole world have changed overnight

There has been a global shock to the world economy

Sport is a relatively inconsequential if enjoyable part of that economy

Sporting finances have always been mainly on the wrong side of viable

To begin with that will mean that revenue this season and beyond will be dramatically reduced for Clubs 

In the business world that means that with declining revenue you have to reduce costs or you go bust

Why would rugby be any different ?

Then there is the very real prospect of no Rugby being played at all this season without a vaccine- read the vaccine thread on rolling maul

Please explain to me which part of this you don't agree with but rest assured I will not reply . I am quite busy ensuring my Rugby Club survives and trying to get my employees back to work.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Intouch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 08:56
This is a post I made on another thread, but same applies here, its slightly adjusted for this topic. 

I have pointed out a couple of clubs, it could have been many, so lets get this straight, Im not having a dig at them in anyway, Im pointing out what I can see are facts.

Firstly If any club at National one is paying retainers at this point they really are delusional, reasons are below, its dead money and it could go on for years, but we know there are some clubs doing this.

It does not matter if the salary cap is 1p or £100k people are missing the point. 

You have some clubs saying in the rugby paper that they are against  a cut, no problems, but tell me why is that same club are all over "go fund me" and "fund raising pages" trying to get income for the club?
Cambridge being the prime example. Yer yer we got £250k to spend it was sorted at Christmas, oh by the way can you all "pay your membership and season tickets early" ( there might be no rugby ) and/or  our fund raising page is ...www....... and we are looking to raise £30k on top
DMP is another, when the Tom Jones concerts get cancelled, if they have not been already, their income landscape will have  totally changed, they might have been lucky and had these covered by insurance, but the day to day income of The Arena has gone for a long time.

I really think the whole landscape of sport outside the top divisions of Football, Rugby and Cricket are in for a massive hard time, not just for one or two seasons either, for a very long time! Sponsors are not going to want to put money into a club when they are having to lay off their work force, what come first a few K into a rugby club or having an extra 2 people employed ? You tell me Mr Trailfinders will have the same budget for his rugby club after nobody has been away for 6 months than before, when Mr Branson is trying to keep him company afloat. 

I think that until there is a vaccine to this you will have no Rugby, not matter how long it takes!

It's only my view but I cannot see rugby being played till we have a solution, therefore clubs will have no income!

Let's look at what could happen. 

This Virus has accounted for 21k + deaths that are in hospitals alone, there is nobody in their correct mind that will take a risk over this. Not one club committee, not one D of R not one player. The death number is climbing and we don't have an answer to it yet, thats a fact, what we do know is its passed from person to person by touch, spit etc, where better to do that than on rugby field on a Saturday, or even better for 2 months pre season with a group of 30 players sweating, using the same water bottles etc 

So if the RFU says ok lets go back and play the game we all love. Two sides meet on a Saturday for a league game,unbeknown one player has COV19 or is carrying it. 
Lets say he's a forward and its passed on at scrum time, from one player to another. You now have 20 players from each side plus officials who now need to spend the next 14 days in Isolation ( so neither club has a side for the next 2 Saturdays)
Move this one step on, what if a player dies from this having contracted COV19 this during a game, the law suit against the club and the RFU will be massive. 

More importantly, will a player risk his health by playing, you will not know that everybody you are playing against or with are clean.

The last point, there is no way that the UK Gov will open bars at clubs when they have pubs shut, what is the difference between having a beer in a pub or at a rugby club bar, that just will not happen.

Im sorry to say and I do hope hope I am very wrong, but club rugby below the Prem does not start till after we have a vaccine. There will be some very difficult choices that are going to have to be made by clubs very soon as they say we are 9/12 months away from getting a vaccine.

So the "big" clubs with the we are alright jack, may well be ok now, but with no season ticket sales, no beer sold, no sponsorship money come in, because there is nothing to sponsor or companies just dont have any liquid cash,no 15 home game sold out lunches, so social events, nothing at all as the padlock is on the clubhouse, lets see what the end result is going to be. There is only so long that people are going to use a fund raising page and if there is no rugby this season and people have paid for their seasons tickets, they will want them rolled over to next!

I think it will be a very drastic salary cap taken out of the clubs hands and imposed by the RFU because they don't want 50% or more of their club game going to the wall, and it will be Champ and National 1 and 2 clubs going to the wall, the grant they(RFU) have given, well if every club in the land thats in a league applies and are given it, it works our about £150 a club!

Sorry but Champ, National 1 and 2 clubs really need to look at the bigger picture and try and see where they will be this time next year, if we have had no rugby for a season!




Edited by Intouch - 28 Apr 2020 at 09:50
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jester10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 09:01
Intouch. Well said, I agree with you that it's unlikely we'll see any rugby any time soon. I'd even go so far as to say 2020/21 season may not happen at all Cry 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FHLH Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 2020 at 19:24
Originally posted by Intouch Intouch wrote:

I have pointed out a couple of clubs, it could have been many, so lets get this straight, I'm not having a dig at them in anyway, I'm pointing out what I can see are facts.

The loss of rugby is a pain, but not as much as COVID-19. As you say, I cannot see any reason to start rugby until a vaccine is found.

The loss of income for clubs is twofold, firstly rugby income - gate, bar, sponsorship but secondly the income from use of the clubhouse and grounds during the day and in the summer for corporate days, conferences, birthday parties and a host of other types. 

This is the income that will be truly missed on the assumption that rugby income covers players costs that are not now being spent, leaving the core overhead of the club infrastructure to be met met or considerably contributed to, from non-rugby sources which are now negated.

Some clubs can meet this deficit from historic reserves, others not.
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