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Revolt in the North

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Cannon View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cannon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 12:21
Originally posted by Dad Dad wrote:

So just heard the Girls U15 &18 Cup's (u15 girls = u14/15 boys, U18girls = U16+Colts boys) has now been dropped from 6 areas to 4

So whilst grown men are complaining about travel on a saturday afternoon - 13 year old girls are deemed capable of playing in a competition where the SW Area will cover from NE bucks (Buckingham RFC & Bletchley have U15 girls) to Cornwall (although looking at last years cup Kingsbridge nr Plymouth furthest SW U15 team). 

Yes there are pools at the beginning of the competition but an area final at a neutral ground could require both teams travelling over 100 miles each way and these are sunday pm games with school the next day as Buckingham to Kingsbridge is min 214 miles by road 
Absolutely ridiculous, there are 2 options. Either increase the number of girls playing and hence more teams (sadly unlikely to happen), or make competitions smaller and having pre and post Xmas seasons and so more regional. I really believe this approach may save Merit Table rugby in our country too, social players are finding travel an issue.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jun 2019 at 12:30
This change is apparently due to the rise in teams meaning 4 groups each with more pools makes more sense than 6 it was last year ( to avoid having to have 3 way semi's)

Girls rugby is growing hugely - 5 years ago there were county u15 teams playing with u13 players on dispensation to get enough for a squad of 20 - now there are county leagues in some counties - if anything the problem is many U18 teams are of a higher standard than local social ladies teams so there is less opportunity to step into a suitable level ladies team locally.

OA's listed further up put out 1st & 2nd Xv (just) U18 Girls teams season before last 

The cup games are all nearly a month apart over the season (to allow local leagues pre Xmas) - with county in Jan/Feb/Mar as well

Round 1 – 29th September

Round 2 – 10th November

Round 3 – 15th December

Regional Quarter Finals  – 12th January

Regional Semi-Finals – 16th February

Regional Final – 15th March

National Semi-Final – 5th April

Final – 3rd May




 


Edited by Dad - 26 Jun 2019 at 12:34
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Novocastrian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 12:48
31 clubs now in the Lancs split off league. 

There is now talk of making it into 3 leagues. One league of 20 fixtures and two leagues of 18 fixtures. 

I was sceptical at first and thought this wouldn’t last more than a season or two, but it seems to be going for  strength to strength and I think the original clubs bold enough to make the decision to breakaway are seeing their risk being rewarded. How long until more and more join them? What effect will this have on Cheshire clubs in the league structure?

I think this shows at lower levels (7 and below) the appetite for more and more league rugby isn’t as important as local fixtures played against old friends. I know there’s a lot of hate out there from the L5/6 clubs and above of the completions review, but at lower levels something drastic needs to change.

Is this the beginning of a schism as more and more 1st XVs in different CBs start to vote with their feet to leave the RFU league structure? I think the RFU need to allow CBS to begin allowing to structure their own league set up at L7 (perhaps L6 as well) and below in order to keep their clubs happy.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 14:05
Originally posted by Novocastrian Novocastrian wrote:

31 clubs now in the Lancs split off league. 

There is now talk of making it into 3 leagues. One league of 20 fixtures and two leagues of 18 fixtures. 

I was sceptical at first and thought this wouldn’t last more than a season or two, but it seems to be going for  strength to strength and I think the original clubs bold enough to make the decision to breakaway are seeing their risk being rewarded. How long until more and more join them? What effect will this have on Cheshire clubs in the league structure?

I think this shows at lower levels (7 and below) the appetite for more and more league rugby isn’t as important as local fixtures played against old friends. I know there’s a lot of hate out there from the L5/6 clubs and above of the completions review, but at lower levels something drastic needs to change.

Is this the beginning of a schism as more and more 1st XVs in different CBs start to vote with their feet to leave the RFU league structure? I think the RFU need to allow CBS to begin allowing to structure their own league set up at L7 (perhaps L6 as well) and below in order to keep their clubs happy.



Sounds like this is starting to mirror the situation in the south east, with Essex, Surrey, Sussex and Kent having their own county structures (just to name 4) - it is the clubs who are ambitious to test themselves at a higher level that venture out of their home county and travel for a higher standard of rugby.

Not sure why this hasn't always been the case up North
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 15:05
The county leagues round London sit under London 3 so are at level 9 and below.
The Lancashire league includes teams from North Lancs and Cumbria (level 7) and below.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 17:48
Originally posted by Camquin Camquin wrote:

The county leagues round London sit under London 3 so are at level 9 and below.
The Lancashire league includes teams from North Lancs and Cumbria (level 7) and below.


I am aware of that, however arguably London area is a special case given the amount of clubs in a condensed area.

Because of this I would argue other regions could/should do as the North West has at a higher level.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loo fighters Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 18:34
Three Wirral clubs joined of late, they'll be back in Cumbria before long.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PiffPaff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Apr 2020 at 19:29
Originally posted by Loo fighters Loo fighters wrote:

Three Wirral clubs joined of late, they'll be back in Cumbria before long.

LF, highly unlikely
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loo fighters Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2020 at 07:45
Originally posted by PiffPaff PiffPaff wrote:

Originally posted by Loo fighters Loo fighters wrote:

Three Wirral clubs joined of late, they'll be back in Cumbria before long.

LF, highly unlikely

Bit toungue in cheek PP. But when you consider Garstang to Ellesmere port isn't dissimilar in mileage than a trip to Keswick, how far is too far?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 373 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2020 at 22:08
Originally posted by Loo fighters Loo fighters wrote:

Originally posted by PiffPaff PiffPaff wrote:

Originally posted by Loo fighters Loo fighters wrote:

Three Wirral clubs joined of late, they'll be back in Cumbria before long.

LF, highly unlikely

Bit toungue in cheek PP. But when you consider Garstang to Ellesmere port isn't dissimilar in mileage than a trip to Keswick, how far is too far?
Congleton as well now. 80 miles between them and Fleetwood. Be interested to see if its split into N/S. Happy to eat some humble pie and see this went far better than I thought.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Apr 2020 at 23:23
Looks like clubs have had no option and they either jumped or didn’t have enough fixtures.

It appears many have done it through gritted teeth.

The distances some will travel will be interesting. Congleton to Burnley would be fun.

To think this was all because clubs in North Manchester didn’t want to travel to Cumbria but now Fleetwood could be travelling to Hoylake.

What a mess and sadly neither of the CB’s nor the ADM Leagues come out of this with any sense of having the best interests of the game at heart especially when Lancs have played the poacher and gamekeeper roles
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Novocastrian Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 10:14
33 clubs now have joined
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Loo fighters Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 10:33
Hoylake & New Brighton will average around 90 miles per away game & all Manchester clubs the same when visiting them... Local???
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 10:41
Bearing in mind travel was the main reason for the breakaway, it would seem that with the distances being mentioned all the breakaway has achieved is taking everything outside the RFU structure.

Maybe this was the intention all along?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 12:30
You’ve basically got a situation know where if a Lancashire club finishes bottom of Level 7 then they have very little option left to them to exist in the structure. 

Want to try and get back to Level 7?  Well you drop to L8 in Cumbria and try and get promoted. Or maybe a Notts, Lincs, Derby League would let them in if they are over to the east of Manchester.  Or perhaps join Yorkshire at L8.

Clubs at L7 this season, if it ever starts, are fighting for their very existence down to the actions of Lancashire CB men and some power crazy individuals.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 13:07
Well if we lose next season there is planty of time for consulatation and an attempt to come up with a batter solution.

Mind you that would involve compromise all round.

Someone - possibly a substantial minority - will prefer the status quo to any proposed new structure. If only because it is what they know.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 14:03
Originally posted by Monkey Boy Monkey Boy wrote:

You’ve basically got a situation know where if a Lancashire club finishes bottom of Level 7 then they have very little option left to them to exist in the structure. 

Want to try and get back to Level 7?  Well you drop to L8 in Cumbria and try and get promoted. Or maybe a Notts, Lincs, Derby League would let them in if they are over to the east of Manchester.  Or perhaps join Yorkshire at L8.

Clubs at L7 this season, if it ever starts, are fighting for their very existence down to the actions of Lancashire CB men and some power crazy individuals.


I assume there is no promotion from the old 'Lancashire route' so how can a Lancashire side be relegated with nowhere to go.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 17:01
Originally posted by Raider999 Raider999 wrote:

Originally posted by Monkey Boy Monkey Boy wrote:

You’ve basically got a situation know where if a Lancashire club finishes bottom of Level 7 then they have very little option left to them to exist in the structure. 

Want to try and get back to Level 7?  Well you drop to L8 in Cumbria and try and get promoted. Or maybe a Notts, Lincs, Derby League would let them in if they are over to the east of Manchester.  Or perhaps join Yorkshire at L8.

Clubs at L7 this season, if it ever starts, are fighting for their very existence down to the actions of Lancashire CB men and some power crazy individuals.


I assume there is no promotion from the old 'Lancashire route' so how can a Lancashire side be relegated with nowhere to go.

There’s L8 Cumbrian clubs looking to get promoted.

They can only get promoted to the L7 league which the Lancashire clubs are in.

So possibly in a couple of seasons L7 could be basically a Cumbrian based league which impacts on L6 North One West clubs getting relegated 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Monkey Boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Apr 2020 at 23:37
https://twitter.com/martynsharkey/status/1255065306583764992?s=21

Parkonians take on it all.

They’ve dropped out of league rugby altogether and effectively playing against lower sides of clubs - the reason being there’s no one left for them to play as all their neighbouring Cheshire have joined the Lancashire leagues set up for Lancashire clubs to play local games and avoid travel. Work that one out!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deva Delinquent Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Apr 2020 at 09:22
Originally posted by Monkey Boy Monkey Boy wrote:

https://twitter.com/martynsharkey/status/1255065306583764992?s=21

Parkonians take on it all.

They’ve dropped out of league rugby altogether and effectively playing against lower sides of clubs - the reason being there’s no one left for them to play as all their neighbouring Cheshire have joined the Lancashire leagues set up for Lancashire clubs to play local games and avoid travel. Work that one out!

How long have they been in NOWIRUL for, was this their first season? 
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