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Heading for the Championship

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Category: League Rugby - www.leaguerugby.co.uk
Forum Name: The Championship
Forum Description: Discuss the 12 clubs forming the English Championship.
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Printed Date: 26 Mar 2019 at 01:15
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Topic: Heading for the Championship
Posted By: islander
Subject: Heading for the Championship
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 15:29
It's anticipated that it will be 'normal service' at the end of the season in terms of one team heading down to GKIPAC from the Prem + one up from Nat 1.

Prem

After this weekend's games, Newcastle (17pts) now 9 pts adrift of both Bristol & Worcester (26) with eight games to go. The Falcons host the Warriors next Sunday in an absolute must-win for the home side. Bristol home to Gloucester on Friday

Nat 1

Amazingly close after the catch-up games yesterday that meant everyone's played 23 games:
  1. Elthamians 86pts
  2. Ampthill 86
  3. Rosslyn Pk 82
  4. Blackheath 78
Lots of key games to come, including Ampthill hosting OE on Mar 9th, and then RP three weeks later.



Replies:
Posted By: The Blues
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 16:03
Watching the Worcester game the commentators said that 25 points has been historically a surviving total.  It looks like Newcastle could be coming back, which is surprising as they did so well last season and look a good squad.  Falcons could do with a  5 - 0 v Warriors.

Ampthill (Tongan retirement home) should be favourites having the home games.  Whoever does come up will need to recruit heavily and will be weaker than Coventry.


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 17:26
The battle of the chequebooks happens in a couple of weeks when Ampthill host OEs. I think Ampthill will Be to strong for OEs upfront and Ampthill backs are now allowed to have the ball which makes them IMO the most improved team this year. That said given the true of Nat1 this season anyone can be beaten.

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: Brizzer
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 18:15
If Newcastle come down I will laugh, laugh and then laugh some more. The only down side is that we will no doubt have MS back on the forum (please no).
Still, we have never beaten the Falcons, so hopefully it will be another notch on the giant killer post.
On the up, I would happily welcome any of those sides. All great clubs with bundles of history. I am sure that Bedford are desperate for Amphill to prevail, I think that the league will really benefit from a fiercely fought local derby like this.
Good luck everyone.


Posted By: Pirate Pig
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 20:25
There's still a lot of rugby to be played and If Newcastle can close the gap to less than 5 points they play Bristol at home on the last day of the season.
As Bristol are one of the main instigators of  'ring fencing' then it would be ironic if they were relegated.


Posted By: Robb
Date Posted: 24 Feb 2019 at 21:16
I hope do Bristol do get relegated for their hypocritical selfish protectionism. Plus for that ridiculous nickname too. 


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 08:05
Still hoping for a late Mose surge
Seriously though, we could do with that derby back. Two (or even four) games that bring in serious cash.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: castleparknight
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 08:12
I want Rotherham back - but unlikely this season.

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Onward and Upwards C'mon Donny!


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 08:23
IMO Falcons, Wuss & Briz are all much stronger than Irish and Ealing. There should always be a price to pay for failure so I still support promotion and relegation instead of ring fencing but any of those clubs would be miles ahead of second place by Christmas. The sad thing is the side that does go up is likely to offload most of the squad that won it for them and recruit a new one. I'd love to see Jersey play Falcons again but a pre-season friendly would be just fine. Good luck to them all.

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 09:13
National 1 is no respecter of reputation - as Coventry know they had at least one season where they struggled to stay up. It is very hard to claim that one promotion place and with three relegation slots almost too easy to drop down.

And there is alnost no financial support, so the teams reflect the ability of the club to raise funds - which may mean a single deep pocketed backer or many smaller ones.

If Rotherham can keep this squad together and perhaps strengthen - then they will be back close to the top next season. But there will be 15 clubs to beat and no gimme games.


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Blood and Sand


Posted By: EverOptimistic
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 11:49
Originally posted by Robb Robb wrote:

I hope do Bristol do get relegated for their hypocritical selfish protectionism. Plus for that ridiculous nickname too. 
 

 Evil Smile


Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 12:52
Not sure that Amps or OE have the infrastructure for the 1,000+ regular crowds they will get. I know Amps are keen to take over the adjoining football pitch and stands but unsure of OE. However, this is rugby, so the purists will be unconcerned as long as a pie and a pint is available during and after the match.
Being a Bedfordshire (Biggleswade) man at heart, go Amps, show them what East Midlands rugby is all about (and keep the funding for infrastructure development, not players)


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"My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts."


Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 13:06
I would have thought that any future development on the Ampthill gorund would be on the upper pitches rather than on the mud bath down by the club house.

There were rumours of a supermarket looking to buy the lower pitches which would have funded much redevelopment  - but given the current state of retail, that might have gone away.


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Blood and Sand


Posted By: The Joy of (Level) 7
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 21:56
If Ampthill were to be promoted how large would the crowds be for the derbies with Bedford? Educated guesswork I know, but what are the rough estimates?

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TJOS


Posted By: Guinness John
Date Posted: 25 Feb 2019 at 22:26
WHEN Ampthill are promoted,perhaps not quite the 4000+ the Boxing Day game attracted but 3000 should be achievable at Goldington Road, it may pose a problem for the return fixture !! It would certainly exceed last weeks 260. If it does happen then what a steep learning curve, on and off the pitch.

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Bedford Blues Supporter of the Year 2010 - 2011


Posted By: cov kid
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 14:53
Heaven forbid promotion for Ampthill. With those facilities !!!!!


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 15:41
At least they have a decent clubhouse.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Raider999
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 16:11
Originally posted by cov kid cov kid wrote:


Heaven forbid promotion for Ampthill. With those facilities !!!!!


Never been to Ampthill, but they cannot be much worse than Old Elthamians

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RAID ON


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 16:19
OE's clubhouse seemed fine when I went there and they had plenty of pitches. A bit of a hike from the railway station but you can say the same about Vallis Way. 

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: gerg_861
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 16:41
Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

OE's clubhouse seemed fine when I went there and they had plenty of pitches. A bit of a hike from the railway station but you can say the same about Vallis Way. 
 
How are you getting to Vallis Way CC? The Castlebar Park branchline station is about 50 meters from the West gate?


Posted By: cov kid
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 20:45
Raider 999. Oh yes they are !


Posted By: Yeeealing
Date Posted: 01 Mar 2019 at 22:47
Vallis way is very easy to get to from castle bar park which is a main line station from Paddington , or easy access from Ealing Broadway by bus . So CC I find your comments a bit odd seeing the only way to jersey is by plane or boat , which I have done on many occasions and really enjoyed the experience. 😎🇳🇬🇳🇬🇳🇬🇳🇬🇳🇬


Posted By: No 7
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 07:56
There is a central line station at 1.8 miles away , Perivale. Actual walking distance under two miles.< ="text/" ="" ="/B1D671CF-E532-4481-99AA-19F420D90332etdefender/huidhui.js?0=0&0=0&0=0">

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Ambition should be made of sterner stuff.


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 10:07
I have been to Ealing more than half a dozen times and via Paddington is not something I would try. Tube to Ealing Broadway then bus is my preferred route from the south. It is no trickier than going to Blackheath. There is the potential problem of OE whether in Nat 1 or the Championship .
Ampthill is relatively easy for me as it’s served by Thameslink. Good way to explore the country.

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pappashanga


Posted By: OldNick
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 11:33
I have heard very few expressions that damn with faint praise more than ‘No trickier than going to Blackheath’ especially since Blackheath moved from Blackheath to somewhere near Dover.


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 11:38
They are in Eltham. Just a few stops further from London Bridge. The walk from the station is less than ten minutes. I found it easier than their old ground. Nice ground and good seating.

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pappashanga


Posted By: Alderman
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 11:43
And of course Old Elthamians are not in Eltham but rather in Grove Park/Mottingham


Posted By: Alderman
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 11:54
Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

OE's clubhouse seemed fine when I went there and they had plenty of pitches. A bit of a hike from the railway station but you can say the same about Vallis Way. 


It is 0.6km from Grove Park railway station, a 10 minute walk at average pace or a gentle stroll for a hardy Northener like Corporal C


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 12:20
Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

OE's clubhouse seemed fine when I went there and they had plenty of pitches. A bit of a hike from the railway station but you can say the same about Vallis Way. 
 
How are you getting to Vallis Way CC? The Castlebar Park branchline station is about 50 meters from the West gate?
I tried Castle Bar once but the link from Paddington wasn't great and the West Gate was shut that day! I have been about a dozen times over the years including occasions when Jersey were not the opposition and have settled on the Train from Gatwick to Victoria, District Line from Victoria to Broadway and then bus to Scotch Common. I did the last leg with Jordy Reid earlier this season and he was kind enough to ensure I got off at the right place and didn't go the wrong way after that. My record for the trip back to Gatwick is under an hour and a half! The RAG & ODP are much easier to get to IMO except when there are replacement buses at Clapham. I have always enjoyed visiting Vallis Way - the home crowd have always been hospitable and appear to know and enjoy their rugby. 

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: workerbee
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 12:49
It will be interesting if either Ampthill or OE's get into the championship. Ampthill , if they do not move will be an experience for any Championship club. There ground is currently not the one outside the clubhouse but a interesting walk through the woods (a SSI site with rare Marsh Violets) there is no stand at present but a bank. Teams cannot warm up and go back to the clubhouse it is too far, the same at half time. They are however very lucky to have the HQ of the Tongan car cleaning club to recruit from.
OE's have a reasonable clubhouse but it is owned by the school no stand but they are looking to relocate, however with a current average gate of under 200 they do not seem to have a big support especially as they are so close to Blackheath. 


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 02 Mar 2019 at 13:09
Yes, Ampthill is an 'exercise' club.
It's a fair old walk from the overflow car park down the road (should you bring a big enough crowd that the clubhouse car park is filled early). And then it's that charming amble through the dingle dell all the way down to the pitch carved out from the hillside.
Just hope it's not flinging it down when you visit.

I've been to much worse though.


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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: cov kid
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 10:27
Where Kimbo would those worse venues be than Ampthill  ? Assume your not limiting it to NL1 in that judgement.
At NL1 level, they are head & shoulders worse than anyone else


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 10:29
I remember taking a shooting stick to Ampthill.

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pappashanga


Posted By: Dan Gleebles
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 11:00
So few games in the Championship Ampthill could share Goldington Rd. Watch this space.


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 11:08
Bedford Scottish

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pappashanga


Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 16:56
After this weekend's results it's less clear who's coming down from the Prem, with Newcastle beating Wuss 17-6 to make it:

8/9: Sale/Leicester 34pts
10: Bristol 30
11: Wuss 26
12: Falcons 21

No change in the Nat 1 standings, the top four all got max pts, so:

1: Ampthill 91
2: Elthamians 91
3: Ross Pk 87
4: Club 82

OE travel to Ampthill on Saturday...


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 17:34
No, CK, I'm thinking of several from lower than that - the worst probably being Westleigh where my beer was watered down by rain. INSIDE the clubhouse! I know they havea fancy new clubhouse now though.
OAs was pretty grim too, when they made us stand outside their clubhouse in the wind and rain (St Albans RL couldn't have been more welcoming at the same ground though. On the RL subject, we once bussed up to Durham for a game and ended up playing on a school field with no open facilities whatsoever ;).
Locally, (RU), Broadstreet's last ground would've taken some beating in the 'worst' stakes. Truly dreadful bog with a derelict blockhouse.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: oldman
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 17:49
Guy's, 
 Peterborough Lions takes some beating on the "worst ground" stakes. While for lack of atmosphere  South Leicester is the worst. Birmingham Solihull, both at Sharmans cross road and Portway must be near the bottom


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oldman


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 23:23
Oooh. I'd forgotten about the eminently forgettable Sharman's Cross. Dire place.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 03 Mar 2019 at 23:49
Its Westcombe Park that moved to Orpington

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Blood and Sand


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 04 Mar 2019 at 09:17
Orpington? Don't know it. Poor?

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Capt Sparrow
Date Posted: 04 Mar 2019 at 15:18
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Orpington? Don't know it. Poor?

Lovely place in leafy Kent wouldn't class it as poor though. Also happens to be the place I was born just down the road from Biggin Hill Airfield. 


Posted By: Brizzer
Date Posted: 04 Mar 2019 at 18:50
Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Orpington? Don't know it. Poor?


Lovely place in leafy Kent wouldn't class it as poor though. Also happens to be the place I was born just down the road from Biggin Hill Airfield. 

A good Kentish lad then Captain. I was born in Bexley so not far away. Never been to Orpington Rugby Club, but Sidcup’s is very nice. Quite a few levels lower mind you.
Now the village of Vigo, that was a club and a half. They didn’t have a clubhouse, just a pub and a farmers field marked out for the match. After the game the players would take their opposite number home, let them have a bath/shower, feed them then everyone would meet back at the pub for a snifter or two.


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 04 Mar 2019 at 19:55
I have absolutely no idea. I was just querying Camquin's posting which I assumed alluded to it being a bad/poor venue.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 04 Mar 2019 at 21:25
Just that it is a long way from Westcombe Park / Blackheath.

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Blood and Sand


Posted By: Brizzer
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 08:47
It looks as though Ampthill have taken a step closer to making the leap to the Championship following a thumping win over OE’s. They have opened up a 5 point gap at the top, but with 5 games to go anything can happen.


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 09:11
Some potential banana skins for Ampthill-Rosslyn Park is a ten pointer, and their last match is Loughborough away, never an easy place.


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pappashanga


Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 10:14
Yesterday's result means Ampthill can probably afford to slip on one of the banana skins...

Equally interesting in the Prem, with Newcastle (25) just three points behind Worcester (28). Leicester (34) & Bristol (35) should have done enough to keep out of danger...


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 10:29
If Newcastle are a run of good form and one of the others starts losing regularly none of those three are safe.
As for Ampthill, I agree, except for the Rosslyn Park game.
If they go up, will they buy lots of players? Unlike Coventry with its big crowds who seem to be able to afford it, they live in the shadow of Bedford.


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pappashanga


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 11:47
But they have a substantial backer , plus RFU money they could go for a younger version of South Sea islanders in an already established community and the change in visa requirements

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 11:49
Good grief

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pappashanga


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 14:05
Originally posted by Pappashanga Pappashanga wrote:

Unlike Coventry with its big crowds who seem to be able to afford it, they live in the shadow of Bedford.


Of course, Cov don't live 'in the shadow' of anyone...

(OK, OK, I get your point )

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 10 Mar 2019 at 14:52
They have a very definite identity and illustrious history. Wasps are newcomers 😳

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pappashanga


Posted By: Fat Albert
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 11:44
A couple of points re Ampthill

There is an active project for relocation within the town to include "proper" facilities, planning restrictions prevent any significant development on the existing "new" pitch site (surrounded by SSSI) including flood lights. It will very definitely not happen in time for season 2019-20, mind. 

The crowd for the game against OEs was 975, roughly 2 to 3 times the average gate comfortably accommodated either on the banks or pitch side. The crowd record was over 2000 for the National 1 promotion playoff against Bishop's Stortford, there was plenty of standing left over, probably could reach 3,000 without stress.

Given that Newcastle, Worcester and Bristol are all winning there is a chance that Leicester Tigers might have to "go down to the woods today" next season, that really would be surreal Wink

As far as the Tongan Massive are concerned, the oldest have been involved with Ampthill for a decade, we're quite literally growing the next generation locally LOL 

Nobody is counting their chickens but all involved know that promotion does not require other teams results to go our way, win our last 5 games and the adventure really begins...

Oh and "Cov Kid", whatever did we do to get your knickers that twisted? Embarrassed



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a Freudian slip is when you say one thing but mean your mother


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 11:59
Good piece,Fat Albert.


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pappashanga


Posted By: OldNick
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 12:01
There is absolutely no way that the Championship should permit Ampthill to play at their current ground in the Championship.

As part of Coventry being granted promotion the club were required to spend several thousand pounds on improving facilities, in a way which cannot be done at Ampthill.

As an example...
As well as improvements which had been put in to our player medical facilities, and additional public medical facility had to be put in within a few yards of the pitch to cope with potential accidents to supporters. Re worjk was requried when it was noticed that there was a single step required to enter this facility - this had to be replaced with a ramp leading back to the nearet level standing by pitchside, allwing access without the use of a step.

Tell me how this can be provided at Ampthill! 


Posted By: Fat Albert
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 12:25
Interesting view ON, I believe you are referring to a ground safety certificate issued by your county council
Quote If you operate a sports ground, you will need to obtain a safety certificate for any regulated stand. A regulated stand is a covered stand that holds 500 or more spectators.

The requirement for a safety certificate comes from Fire Safety and Safety of Places of Sport Act 1987

A safety certificate may be either:

  • a general safety certificate which covers the use of the stand for viewing an activity, or a number of activities, specified in the certificate for an indefinite period which starts on a specified date
  • a special safety certificate which covers the use of the stand for viewing a certain specified activity or activities on a certain specified occasion or occasions

One certificate may cover more than one stand.

You must comply with any conditions attached to a certificate.
Of course not having a stand that has a capacity of 500 or more or even any stand at all might mean that your observation doesn't apply to Ampthill.
 

Do you really think that those that have guided Ampthill from level 7 in 2006 to the fringe of level 2 in 2019 haven't looked at the consequences of promotion? If you do I have some shares for sale in a startup that intends to sell Tower Bridge to Beijing...




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a Freudian slip is when you say one thing but mean your mother


Posted By: JonDee
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 12:47
An interesting point if one of the big boys does get relegated a number of clubs in the Championship would have to review their ground capacities and staffing as laid out in The Green Guide  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Guide.
Last time Nottingham played Tigers in a meaningful game I think we had 5000 + at Ireland Avenue
the cost of temporary stands extra stewarding (of the correct level) food and drink outlets was massive





Posted By: ruckinspector
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 12:54
Why did Coventry not spend some of their money on their pitch? Sadly it is simply not up to Championship standard.


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One day this pain will make sense to you


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:04
1.5 million to be spent on it in April should cover that concern.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:06
Besides, it's actually held up pretty well this season given there are currently four clubs playing on it. The surface was perfectly acceptable for tbe Richmond game.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Camquin
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:07
Having watched the TV coverage of the game at the Rec, it is obviously good enough for premiership use. I also believe they have a plan to install a new artificial or hybrid suface.

If Ampthill does nto meet Championship standard, I assume OEs don't.
OEs would presumably have to ground share, I seem to recall someing suggesting they may look at Rectory Field (but that could have been a wind up)

I have no idea how close the facilities at the Rock or the Plesance are - I assume they would need the same sort of audit and improvement as Cov underwent.




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Blood and Sand


Posted By: Moseley Mauler
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:27
What about enabling disabled and/or elderly visitors to watch the game? Impossible at Ampthill. Not good enough and something must be done - even if they aren't promoted


Posted By: OldNick
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:48
Originally posted by ruckinspector ruckinspector wrote:

Why did Coventry not spend some of their money on their pitch? Sadly it is simply not up to Championship standard.

There is no Championship standard. There are however legal requirements when accepting  the publivc to watch matches. 


Posted By: OldNick
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:49
Originally posted by Moseley Mauler Moseley Mauler wrote:

What about enabling disabled and/or elderly visitors to watch the game? Impossible at Ampthill. Not good enough and something must be done - even if they aren't promoted

Another legal requirement. I think Ampthill would say that they comply by allowing cars carrying disabled customers to enter via the rear gate and watch from their vehicle from the top of the bank. They however cannot visit the clubhouse.


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 13:56
If all else fails and the top 3 lose a couple of games and we win ours Blackheath have 2 championship grounds in Well Hall and Rectory Field easy Peasy 😂

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 14:09
Originally posted by OldNick OldNick wrote:

Originally posted by Moseley Mauler Moseley Mauler wrote:

What about enabling disabled and/or elderly visitors to watch the game? Impossible at Ampthill. Not good enough and something must be done - even if they aren't promoted

Another legal requirement. I think Ampthill would say that they comply by allowing cars carrying disabled customers to enter via the rear gate and watch from their vehicle from the top of the bank. They however cannot visit the clubhouse.
Disabled access and toilet facilities etc should certainly comply with proper standards but with good will, money & commitment most problems like this have a practical solution. If Amptil or OEs should win N1 on merit I hope they are given a fair chance to sort out any practical issues or find an alternative ground and compete in the Championship - both have visited St Peter in the past and given a great account of themselves.

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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: Dad
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 16:50
From a disability Discrimination Act (i know it has been superceeded now but easier for people to understand as a name)

You do need to make "reasonable adjustments" to allow in disabled persons - what is reasonable is up to interpretation - it could mean laying some temporary plastic hardstanding and providing a disabled portaloo plus ferrying anyone needing access on a buggy from the clubhouse - that could be seen as "reasonable" whilst forcing them to install a roadway through an SSI would most definately not be seen as a reasonable requirement


Posted By: KnightsBoy
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 17:01
Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

Originally posted by OldNick OldNick wrote:

Originally posted by Moseley Mauler Moseley Mauler wrote:

What about enabling disabled and/or elderly visitors to watch the game? Impossible at Ampthill. Not good enough and something must be done - even if they aren't promoted


Another legal requirement. I think Ampthill would say that they comply by allowing cars carrying disabled customers to enter via the rear gate and watch from their vehicle from the top of the bank. They however cannot visit the clubhouse.
Disabled access and toilet facilities etc should certainly comply with proper standards but with good will, money & commitment most problems like this have a practical solution. If Amptil or OEs should win N1 on merit I hope they are given a fair chance to sort out any practical issues or find an alternative ground and compete in the Championship - both have visited St Peter in the past and given a great account of themselves.


You can hire toilet blocks/Porta cabins with disabled access, so it shouldnt be an issue.


Posted By: islander
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 17:31
I suppose it's inevitable that potential newcomers to any arena will be viewed with suspicion and hostility in some quarters by those who are an established part of said arena. I think that's a pity. Ampthill are favourites as a result of Saturday's win - I've not been there, although we (Jersey) have played them at home and on neutral ground ('HQ'); DoR Paul Turner is a regular visitor to Jersey as his son Tommy lives here and used to play for Jersey 1sts - he still turns out for the 2s occasionally; it sounds like they have quite a different set-up, but as long as certain minimum standards can be satisfied, I'd hope they will provide a welcome point of difference.

Some other recently-promoted clubs may also have been viewed as 'abnormal' for various reasons, Jersey and Hartpury to name two, but a league can be a broad church, can't it, rather than all the clubs and grounds being the same? Hopefully all clubs bring something to the party, and can be treated with respect, even if it's inevitable that supporters may develop a 'pecking order' of their favourites and least favourites.

As mentioned, I imagine those clubs in with a shout of promotion will have given the matter some thought, although it's still a big jump, there's no doubt about that.

Whoever makes it I look forward to welcoming them to the Championship next season.


Posted By: Fat Albert
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 18:20


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a Freudian slip is when you say one thing but mean your mother


Posted By: Brizzer
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 18:43
Very true Islander.
I remember when we came up we had a small stand which holds approx. 250 seats (it's still there), no other cover around the ground and a small muddy bank lined with trees behind 1 of the goals.

Now look at us, we have a Stade   


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 18:45
Ah, there's the solution.
The Stade Fairy Dell has a ring to it.

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: RobC
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 19:48
Originally posted by ruckinspector ruckinspector wrote:

Why did Coventry not spend some of their money on their pitch? Sadly it is simply not up to Championship standard.


Sadly we went and got ourselves promoted a year ahead of schedule, hence us not having our new pitch ready in time for the expansive style of rugby played in the Championship...


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 11 Mar 2019 at 23:33
And that, as Rob succinctly puts it, is that.

(Except that I don't agree with the 'sadly' bit. ).

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: RobC
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 07:03
Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

And that, as Rob succinctly puts it, is that.

(Except that I don't agree with the 'sadly' bit. ).


There was a couple of bits of irony in my post Kimbo.


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 08:33
Oh, I noticed the second one too Rob. Hard to miss. 😁

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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 09:05
Yes the Championship has much in common with medieval battles.Only they didn’t have HIAs.

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pappashanga


Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 09:18
I have to say that while I miss visiting some of the Championship clubs, I really don't miss the Championship... There's something wrong there, where tier 1's a de facto closed shop, tier 3 is a lot of fun where you can throw the ball around and play expansive rugby (although we haven't had much fun this season....), and tier 2 is a weird no man's land that has the advantages of neither above nor below and a mickey mouse cup thrown in. 

While I'd love Mose to be playing at the highest level possible, if there was a way of becoming the Bedford of National 1 and just sitting top half year after year I reckon that would be preferable to being the Bedford of the Championship. At least we'd have a league game every Saturday.



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keep the faith


Posted By: Rob C
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 10:33
Originally posted by billesleyexile billesleyexile wrote:

I have to say that while I miss visiting some of the Championship clubs, I really don't miss the Championship... There's something wrong there, where tier 1's a de facto closed shop, tier 3 is a lot of fun where you can throw the ball around and play expansive rugby (although we haven't had much fun this season....), and tier 2 is a weird no man's land that has the advantages of neither above nor below and a mickey mouse cup thrown in. 

While I'd love Mose to be playing at the highest level possible, if there was a way of becoming the Bedford of National 1 and just sitting top half year after year I reckon that would be preferable to being the Bedford of the Championship. At least we'd have a league game every Saturday.


Championship and fun are two words rarely mentioned in the same sentence.  To be fair we were forewarned but attritional is perhaps the best word for most of the matches I've watched...

Cov tried the style of rugby that won them National League One early in the season but now seem to have resigned themselves to adopting aerial ping pong / bash it up through the middle rugby.  Very disappointing.


Posted By: billesleyexile
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 11:05
Originally posted by Rob C Rob C wrote:

Originally posted by billesleyexile billesleyexile wrote:

I have to say that while I miss visiting some of the Championship clubs, I really don't miss the Championship... There's something wrong there, where tier 1's a de facto closed shop, tier 3 is a lot of fun where you can throw the ball around and play expansive rugby (although we haven't had much fun this season....), and tier 2 is a weird no man's land that has the advantages of neither above nor below and a mickey mouse cup thrown in. 

While I'd love Mose to be playing at the highest level possible, if there was a way of becoming the Bedford of National 1 and just sitting top half year after year I reckon that would be preferable to being the Bedford of the Championship. At least we'd have a league game every Saturday.


Championship and fun are two words rarely mentioned in the same sentence.  To be fair we were forewarned but attritional is perhaps the best word for most of the matches I've watched...

Cov tried the style of rugby that won them National League One early in the season but now seem to have resigned themselves to adopting aerial ping pong / bash it up through the middle rugby.  Very disappointing.

Yes, I think I was one of the ones doing the warning! Cov deserved to go up and take their promotion, and despite my thoughts on the Championship I was happy for them. We had a decade of bore-fests largely in the Championship, relegation to National 1 genuinely felt like a liberation.

That's not right - it points to structural failings. One or two clubs trying to go up, a couple happy to sit in the middle with no more ambition, and everyone else desperately trying not to come last... Attritional is certainly one of the politer words that you could use to describe the style of rugby that keeps the central funding cheque coming in.

Being scrupulously fair, of course, National 1 has its own problems - just that they tend to be off-pitch and related to facilities IMO. We've probably got too many clubs that rely on a cheque book to sign great teams, without worrying about infrastructure. The actual rugby is much more fun for the spectators.

Personally I'd be looking at introducing MSC for the National Leagues (or at least N2 upwards) - e.g. no one should be at Level 3 without at least 500 covered seats and floodlights, and taking Level 2 to at least two if not 3 down every year. If nothing else it would shake some of the lower Level 2 clubs out of their torpor. I say that even though it would have seen Mose down a lot earlier than we eventually left. 

Like I say, I miss going to Pirates and Bedford in particular*, but I don't miss the league.

*and all the great people I met at every other club (never got to Jersey), but there are great people down here too....
 




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keep the faith


Posted By: corporalcarrot
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 11:56
Originally posted by Rob C Rob C wrote:

Championship and fun are two words rarely mentioned in the same sentence.  To be fair we were forewarned but attritional is perhaps the best word for most of the matches I've watched...

Cov tried the style of rugby that won them National League One early in the season but now seem to have resigned themselves to adopting aerial ping pong / bash it up through the middle rugby.  Very disappointing.
 

I watched Albion play DMP on Saturday and Pirates play Jersey on Sunday and thoroughly enjoyed both games which were an object lesson in the difference between the two leagues. The Championship is a country mile ahead in fitness, speed & conditioning of players, forward power and most of all defence - there were probably twice as many tries than dominant tackles at Brickfields. The banter on the terrace and beer in the bar was equally as good at both Brickfields and the Mennaye. At its best the Championship produces great expansive rugby and clubs like Blues, Scottish, Pirates and even Jersey on their day can be a delight to watch but at the top of the tree its very often exclusively forward power & five metre lineouts and mauled tries with the Hooker as the top scorer. Personally I'd rather watch Albion than the very top clubs in the Championship where ambition has often lead to very limited but effective rugby. Jersey's position and limited population probably excludes them from ever being a premiership team but I have seen them play a fair bit this season and most games have been fun and great to watch including the defensive masterclass by both teams at the Mennaye on Saturday.


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Dont kick it. Pick it up and GO FORWARD.


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 12:50
There are minimum standards for both Nat1 and 2. The problem is they haven’t been enforced over the last few years. They are still on the NCA site (orwere when this discussion was hard previously). I believe there is to be a return to regular inspections.

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: Rob C
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 12:53
Originally posted by Rabbie Burns Rabbie Burns wrote:

There are minimum standards for both Nat1 and 2. The problem is they haven’t been enforced over the last few years. They are still on the NCA site (orwere when this discussion was hard previously). I believe there is to be a return to regular inspections.

Standards of rugby or are we back to the BPA pitch again?


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 15:45
No it was a reply to a question about minimum standards. Personally I have no problem with BPA and think it is a terrific facility except when they took away part of the visitors dressing room to extend the physio room. IMO the pitch is no different to many others and struggles with drainage when wet.

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: Rob C
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 15:50
Originally posted by Rabbie Burns Rabbie Burns wrote:

No it was a reply to a question about minimum standards. Personally I have no problem with BPA and think it is a terrific facility except when they took away part of the visitors dressing room to extend the physio room. IMO the pitch is no different to many others and struggles with drainage when wet.

The physio room extension was as a result of an away player horrifically breaking his leg and them not being able to fit the stretcher through the door. Needs must...


Posted By: Kimbo
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 17:08
You mean we have a changing room for visiting teams?

Luxury.

You'll be telling me we give them hot water next.


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Our City,
Our Club


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 20:59
Funnily enough not a lot

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: FHLH
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2019 at 23:21
Nat 1 standards went hand in hand with the £75k funding. When that went so did investment in infrastructure.

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"My father told me big men fall just as quick as little ones, if you put a sword through their hearts."


Posted By: fatbear
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 07:28
Gosh, rugby in the Championship must be awful to watch.
 
As a follower of a side promoted from N2S to N1 this season I have been disappointed by the lack of ambition shown by most sides visiting Chinnor. Of course some visiting backs have scored some wonderful tries but nearly all sides have monster packs with plan A being to win scrum penalties, kick to the corner and score from rolling mauls. Plan B is to have the big forwards bash through the middle. Occasionally the backs are allowed the ball, but most of the time their role is defensive. Only OEs have played what might be called an expansive game at Kingsey Road ( note : Loughborough are still to visit )
 
The excitement from watching Chinnor this season is that until last weekend's drubbing by Moseley, all matches have been in doubt until the very end, and anyone can beat anyone eg at home Chinnor have beaten Ampthill & Rotherham, drawn with OEs and Rosslyn Park, yet lost to Moseley, Caldy and Bishops Stortford. We also lost at Loughborough. Our backs are good to watch though, if they get to see the ball..........
 
Ampthill would appear to be tailor made for life in the Championship - at least on the pitch !


Posted By: Rabbie Burns
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 07:35
Fatbear you must be upset with the two props you have signed for next season and your DORs comments

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So many Christians not enough Lions


Posted By: kingsheathlad
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 08:23
I think we all want free flowing rugby with the ball along the backs and wingers scoring,but it is league and you have to play to your strengths.Our backs did score at Chinnor on Saturday.

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Cauliflower ear


Posted By: Rob C
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 08:25
Originally posted by fatbear fatbear wrote:

Gosh, rugby in the Championship must be awful to watch.
 
As a follower of a side promoted from N2S to N1 this season I have been disappointed by the lack of ambition shown by most sides visiting Chinnor. Of course some visiting backs have scored some wonderful tries but nearly all sides have monster packs with plan A being to win scrum penalties, kick to the corner and score from rolling mauls. Plan B is to have the big forwards bash through the middle. Occasionally the backs are allowed the ball, but most of the time their role is defensive. Only OEs have played what might be called an expansive game at Kingsey Road ( note : Loughborough are still to visit )
 
The excitement from watching Chinnor this season is that until last weekend's drubbing by Moseley, all matches have been in doubt until the very end, and anyone can beat anyone eg at home Chinnor have beaten Ampthill & Rotherham, drawn with OEs and Rosslyn Park, yet lost to Moseley, Caldy and Bishops Stortford. We also lost at Loughborough. Our backs are good to watch though, if they get to see the ball..........
 
Ampthill would appear to be tailor made for life in the Championship - at least on the pitch !

It seems that this style of rugby, built around huge players, is filtering down through the leagues whilst, ironically, some of the premiership teams are now adopting a running game.

Our DOR seems to have developed an obsession with large props of late in an apparent bid to gain parity, and who can blame him...



Posted By: Pappashanga
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 08:48
The bonus point system does reward enterprising back play, but a safety first mentality stifles it. The scrum penalty system and the rolling maul are two negative factors.


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pappashanga


Posted By: kingsheathlad
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 08:57
[QUOTE=Pappashanga] The bonus point system does reward enterprising back play, but a safety first mentality stifles it. The scrum penalty system and the rolling maul are two negative factors.
[/QUOTE

The rolling maul can produce tries to get you a tbp, which happened this season against Rotherham by my team.]

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Cauliflower ear


Posted By: backrowb
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 08:57
Defence is king now. We need to play 14, or even 13, a side


Posted By: Rob C
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 09:06
Originally posted by Pappashanga Pappashanga wrote:

The bonus point system does reward enterprising back play, but a safety first mentality stifles it. The scrum penalty system and the rolling maul are two negative factors.

The bonus point system rewards tries of any sort and the easiest way to score them is by getting penalties and 5 metre lineouts.


Posted By: Capt Sparrow
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 10:03
[QUOTE=Rob C][QUOTE=fatbear] Gosh, rugby in the Championship must be awful to watch./Unquote

You've obviously not seen a Pirates/Bedford game where both teams first ambition is to play an attractive running game of rugby. Yes both sides can and do kick to the corner if the opportunity arises but it is definitely not plan A as it is in a lot of teams.
 




Posted By: Rob C
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 10:44
Originally posted by Capt Sparrow Capt Sparrow wrote:

[QUOTE=Rob C][QUOTE=fatbear] Gosh, rugby in the Championship must be awful to watch./Unquote

You've obviously not seen a Pirates/Bedford game where both teams first ambition is to play an attractive running game of rugby. Yes both sides can and do kick to the corner if the opportunity arises but it is definitely not plan A as it is in a lot of teams.
 



The 53 - 52 match Cov played against Bedford is an example of two teams wanting to play expansive rugby.  Yes, it's easy to say that defences weren't at the fore that game but the running and passing was sublime from both teams.

Unfortunately that match has proved to be the exception to the rule.


Posted By: Trailfinder
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2019 at 10:45
Dare I suggest it but could ringfencing improve the general quality of the rugby played in the Championship?



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