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National 2 South status

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Raider999 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 17:28
Originally posted by @boatyjames @boatyjames wrote:

I think we were a bit unlucky getting yourselves and Barnstaple (also seriously bad on the road) as our 1st two home games when we really weren't ready for this league. Suspect we would win both those games now. Anyhow we are where we are - looks unlikely but you never know. I think we will win both of our last 2 games and go down.



Interesting - to what do you put the recent improvement down to?
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Darth Raider View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darth Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 17:34
No sympathy there really Boaty......the alternative view is that the fixtures secretary did Dons a big favour.  starting with two home games AND against sides that were very beatable.  It could have been a flier ?

As it stands, if if you do go down, you should bounce straight back if you can retain your squad ?  You should definitely be ready next time.   

That game at home to Old Reds on Saturday will be a humdinger .....another 'cup final' for you.  If Old Reds even get two BP's then that is one team you cannot catch......and you are then really relying on Raiders.  Have you considered a substantial bribe Wink  Large quantities of weapons-grade ale might do the job LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote @boatyjames Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 17:38
We went up with a side that had grown with the club over a number of years and featured quite a few antipodeans who weren't eligible in N2S. Also our star players from last year, No 8 and 10, left (one to go pro at Jersey and the other to Australia). So we started the new season with a virtually new side and the one "star" we recruited (Chris York - ex Ealing T's) got badly injured in his first game. The first few months of the season were also a never ending injury crisis (perhaps because we were not used to the extra physicality). Last couple of months the injured players have come back and we have had a fairly settled side. With a settled side we seem to be able to compete with most in the league.
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@boatyjames View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote @boatyjames Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 17:41
No sympathy expected Darth. I could make a trip to London Irish with a large pot of Gold if you do the business at Barnstaple!
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Raider999 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 21:17
Originally posted by @boatyjames @boatyjames wrote:

We went up with a side that had grown with the club over a number of years and featured quite a few antipodeans who weren't eligible in N2S. Also our star players from last year, No 8 and 10, left (one to go pro at Jersey and the other to Australia). So we started the new season with a virtually new side and the one "star" we recruited (Chris York - ex Ealing T's) got badly injured in his first game. The first few months of the season were also a never ending injury crisis (perhaps because we were not used to the extra physicality). Last couple of months the injured players have come back and we have had a fairly settled side. With a settled side we seem to be able to compete with most in the league.


The antipodian situation is one I believe Barnes have had problems with in the past (I presume this is likely to affect London based sides more because they congregate there).

As for the number of injuries because of the increased physicality - if you get through a season without a number of long term injuries you are indeed fortunate.

I recall Dorking having very few injuries in their first season but were plagued with them the following term.

I think you need a squad of at least 30 players, all of whom need to be of the standard required for this level, to get through a season. It is particularly attritional in the first half of the season when there are normally games every week, although there was one free week this season.

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Darth Raider View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darth Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Apr 2018 at 22:16
Hi Steve......two points.

1.  Going back a very long way.....Raiders progress was dictated primarily, by a group of Kiwis who were brought over by our wonderful and ambitious president of the time, and stayed for years and were an integral part of the team.  They had settled here so it seemed a savage outcome when they helped take us to promotion....only to be excluded and forced to return home the year after Ouch.  

2.  You are right about Dorking and Barnes in particular......the latter are (perhaps) the most yo-yo side around and maybe because of this.  They have just gone top of their league again so we may well be saying g'day mate to them again next year WinkWinkClapClap

As to squad size....I would have to disagree.  If you look at how many players are deployed by an average level 4 side over the course of  season, I THINK yo will find that it is between 50 and 60, unless they have been very fortunate ?  Not sure......but pretty sure I am right ?  Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Porkpieman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 01:10
Please excuse my ignorance but what's the antipodean issue all about??
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 02:08
The limits on non English players are strictly enforced in National leagues.
Of course, many anitpodean players manage to become English or EU citizens - or qualify under Kolpak regulation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Tyke Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 09:57
Visa restrictions apply to all players without UK/EU passports, Kolpak only determines whether they are considered "Foreign" Thus a Fijian with a suitable visa is not foreign (Kolpak) but an Australian is. If the All Blacks all married English girls and came over here on spouse visas and signed for your club you could play 2 of them each week because they would still be foreign players. If the Springboks did the same thing you could play them all every week because, under Kolpak, they are not overseas players. Confused
If only Webb-Ellis hadn't given them the ball back!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 14:02
All this kolpak status may go out of the window when we leave the EU.

Cricket has similar problems, however other factors seem to apply-

A professional player from overseas can come over (assuming you can pay him enough)
An amateur player from overseas has all sorts of restrictions applied by the home office (these seem to change each year) - use of an agent, payment of flights, having been on the professional pathway at a junior level for example can disallow them unless they are a current professional.
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Raider999 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 14:07
Originally posted by Darth Raider Darth Raider wrote:

Hi Steve......two points.

1.  Going back a very long way.....Raiders progress was dictated primarily, by a group of Kiwis who were brought over by our wonderful and ambitious president of the time, and stayed for years and were an integral part of the team.  They had settled here so it seemed a savage outcome when they helped take us to promotion....only to be excluded and forced to return home the year after Ouch.  

2.  You are right about Dorking and Barnes in particular......the latter are (perhaps) the most yo-yo side around and maybe because of this.  They have just gone top of their league again so we may well be saying g'day mate to them again next year WinkWinkClapClap

As to squad size....I would have to disagree.  If you look at how many players are deployed by an average level 4 side over the course of  season, I THINK yo will find that it is between 50 and 60, unless they have been very fortunate ?  Not sure......but pretty sure I am right ?  Smile


Darth - sorry I didn't make myself clear, when I said 30 I was meaning the number of hard core first team squad members required. Supplemented by a number of reserves who might make a few appearances each.

Not sure any side (Chinnor) apart could afford to have 50-60 full first team squad members.

As for Worthing having a number of antipodean players in the past - haven't seen any since I have been watching (last 8-9 seasons) but bow to your longevity on the subject.
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Darth Raider View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Darth Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 14:27
Just FYI Steve......all Kiwis as follows:

Rowan O'Gorman.......a young no8.  A real talent who left us after a year for more dosh at Canterbury.  I think he may have been the top tryscorer in the league in his year with us. .  
Duncan Taylor.....another good young player.....bit of a utility back...12/13/14/15 as I recall.
Jamie Stewart-McDonald......played at 10 or 12 I think, but mostly as a mobile battering ram !!  Quite outstandingly physical. 
Todd Murphy.....excellent scum half.....arguably the best I've seen at the club, though I'm relatively new myself. 
All excellent rugby footballers IMO.  I can't recall what years they played.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rabbie Burns Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 16:31
Just to clarify gents you can only play inLevels 3 & 4 if you hold an EU passport even as an amateur. You can have issues with spouse visas and you cannot register a professional on a sporting visa for levels 3 & 4 only 2 and upwards and those players cannot subsequently be loaned out to another club.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Halliford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 17:15
Originally posted by Darth Raider Darth Raider wrote:

Hi Steve......two points.

1.  Going back a very long way.....Raiders progress was dictated primarily, by a group of Kiwis who were brought over by our wonderful and ambitious president of the time, and stayed for years and were an integral part of the team.  They had settled here so it seemed a savage outcome when they helped take us to promotion....only to be excluded and forced to return home the year after Ouch.  


Hang on! Before all those Kiwis there were a lot of good English players at Worthing. Remember the Sevens team that used to star annually at the Middlesex Sevens? I coached with Peter Greenwood in the 1980s and we had a high-quality back line including Laurie Stappers, Tim Mackew, Jon Forrest, Mark O'Connor, Paul Coackley, Jeremy Reckless, etc. Now those were the really, really good days!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barum man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 17:20
I hope Barum have not broken any rules by playing a few Cornish lads this season Smile . We did  have a then current All Black play for our 2s once (he was not qualified to play in the firsts at level 5!!!).




Edited by Barum man - 17 Apr 2018 at 17:21
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Old Hooker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 17:46
I agree Halliford remember taking my youngest son to Twickers for the 7s
Great days and team many still about the club
another one against the head
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Old Hooker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 17:49
Barum Man.
We will do a full audit of your team when we come on Sat, Oh yes and the Bar
another one against the head
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Barum man View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Barum man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 19:01
Originally posted by Old Hooker Old Hooker wrote:

Barum Man.
We will do a full audit of your team when we come on Sat, Oh yes and the Bar

Thumbs Up I look forward to it - hope you do not stuff us by too many points.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RedPete Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 19:22
Originally posted by Barum man Barum man wrote:

I hope Barum have not broken any rules by playing a few Cornish lads this season Smile . We did  have a then current All Black play for our 2s once (he was not qualified to play in the firsts at level 5!!!).


 
And very sadly, no longer with us IIRC
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mark W-J Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Apr 2018 at 19:30
Didn't he wear the Barnstaple socks when representing the Baa-Baas at Twickenham?
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