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Confirmed Championship start date
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Stalwart View Drop Down
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Points: 1902 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stalwart Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2021 at 22:02
Pirates having Sarries in PZ for the first game is probably a good thing and gives us a fighting chance, except that there will be no spectators. Normally The Mennaye would be packed, the Falmouth Marine Band in attendance and some proper Cornish passion (and pasties!)
Shame, too, that the Sarries supporters will miss out on a trip to beautiful Kernow. 
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I see we - Jersey Reds have Saracens away to start Confused and its the 13th.
I'm with islander, its time for some positivity, and look forward to the Handshakerestart.
Come on Jersey........
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Points: 3497 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote corporalcarrot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2021 at 07:27
Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

  • Why does the location for Sarries v Ealing matter? Aren't these clubs shoo-ins to finish 1st/2nd, in whatever order, and contest the final, with no real advantage to the side that finishes above the other during the regular season?
Bullet no4 comes with a large Wink
The location of the Sarries v Ealing match facilitates a continuation of the whinging posts suggesting without foundation that the fixtures have been unfairly constructed. The two grounds are probably only a dozen miles apart! I still fancy Pirates to make the play-offs and hope to see all Jersey's matches on line or from the touchline. A great effort by everyone involved in getting to this stage - lets see some rugby played!
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Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

Originally posted by islander islander wrote:

  • Why does the location for Sarries v Ealing matter? Aren't these clubs shoo-ins to finish 1st/2nd, in whatever order, and contest the final, with no real advantage to the side that finishes above the other during the regular season?
Bullet no4 comes with a large Wink
The location of the Sarries v Ealing match facilitates a continuation of the whinging posts suggesting without foundation that the fixtures have been unfairly constructed. The two grounds are probably only a dozen miles apart! I still fancy Pirates to make the play-offs and hope to see all Jersey's matches on line or from the touchline. A great effort by everyone involved in getting to this stage - lets see some rugby played!

Given that Ealing beat Saracens more comprehensively away than at home, perhaps I should be lauding this outcome. Nevertheless, I would be very interested in understanding how these fixtures are generated. Year on year, it seems that there is some level of contrivance to the fixtures list. If someone were to tell me that they were genuinely randomly generated, then I'd be happy to shut up on the topic, but given the overly fortuitous bye week for Saracens, I smell a rat.

Nevertheless, very happy to have rugby returning, very happy that we'll get to play every team at least once, and very happy that there will be an end of season play off - I'll cheer on whoever gets into it.
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Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Nevertheless, I would be very interested in understanding how these fixtures are generated. Year on year, it seems that there is some level of contrivance to the fixtures list. If someone were to tell me that they were genuinely randomly generated, then I'd be happy to shut up on the topic, but given the overly fortuitous bye week for Saracens, I smell a rat.

I totally agree with you about some behind the scenes shenanigans - what I would like to see is a live draw of the fixtures (easily could be streamed in this day and age). And there is a way to ensure that an even split of home and away fixture occur across the season relatively even so that shouldn't inhibit this occurring. 
Onward and Upwards C'mon Donny!
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Points: 3497 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote corporalcarrot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2021 at 11:49
This thread seems to reflect huge similarity to the recent arguments advanced (without apparent foundation) that the US presidential election was fixed. Statements inferring "behind the scenes shenanigans" and "smelling rats" if said often enough apparently do not need facts to back them up if they are posted often enough.  The eleven clubs involved will be close to this and unless any of them express concern I  hope we can get on and enjoy watching some rugby.
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What is interesting is fixtures normally produced by the RFU are created using something called a Berger Matrix. Simply put you put x amount of Teams is a list and select what type of fixtures you want,  Home & Away full league season full Fixtures, 16 Teams, 14, 12, 10, and 8. Doesn't seem to have an option for just 11 Teams playing a half season so my guess is they used a 12 Team Matrix with the 12th Team being "Bye".

I'll let you know if I can work on the right pattern using the Berger Matrix. If I can't then I would suggest someone did it manually.
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If they couldn't use the matrix maybe they asked Mark McCall to do it??
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Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

This thread seems to reflect huge similarity to the recent arguments advanced (without apparent foundation) that the US presidential election was fixed. Statements inferring "behind the scenes shenanigans" and "smelling rats" if said often enough apparently do not need facts to back them up if they are posted often enough.  The eleven clubs involved will be close to this and unless any of them express concern I  hope we can get on and enjoy watching some rugby.
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Originally posted by PiffPaff PiffPaff wrote:

What is interesting is fixtures normally produced by the RFU are created using something called a Berger Matrix. Simply put you put x amount of Teams is a list and select what type of fixtures you want,  Home & Away full league season full Fixtures, 16 Teams, 14, 12, 10, and 8. Doesn't seem to have an option for just 11 Teams playing a half season so my guess is they used a 12 Team Matrix with the 12th Team being "Bye".

I'll let you know if I can work on the right pattern using the Berger Matrix. If I can't then I would suggest someone did it manually.


You are correct, for a 11 team league you would use the 12 team matrix with team 12 being 'bye'.
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Back to rugby... away at Pirates first up will have been the last fixture Saracens would have wanted but what pre season preparation will Pirates have? By then Saracens will have their Barbarians players back and 5 preseason games under their belt so will be firing. 
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Originally posted by Trailfinder Trailfinder wrote:

Back to rugby... away at Pirates first up will have been the last fixture Saracens would have wanted but what pre season preparation will Pirates have? By then Saracens will have their Barbarians players back and 5 preseason games under their belt so will be firing. 

This is a good question, as far as I can see, the preparations that I am aware of are:

Ealing - 8 matches! (2xNewcastle, Saracens, Donacaster, Bristol A)

Saracens - 5 matches (2 x Ealing, Doncaster, 2 x Coventry)

Doncaster - 3 matches (2 x Ealing, 1 x Saracens)

Coventry - 2 x Saracens

Can anyone add to this?
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Originally posted by corporalcarrot corporalcarrot wrote:

This thread seems to reflect huge similarity to the recent arguments advanced (without apparent foundation) that the US presidential election was fixed. Statements inferring "behind the scenes shenanigans" and "smelling rats" if said often enough apparently do not need facts to back them up if they are posted often enough.  The eleven clubs involved will be close to this and unless any of them express concern I  hope we can get on and enjoy watching some rugby.

CC - I too look forward watching some Rugby but I disagree with your read on the fixtures - you have been around this league long enough to know that certain convenient things occur (usually for the favourite team coming down)  each season to be pure chance. However, happy to be proven wrong - if a public draw was made (a la FA Cup style) that would disperse all allegations of Shenanigans and I would gladly retract my claims and apologies will be given for alluding to wee tweaks of convenience being applied to the fixtures. Until then I shall continue to believe it is so. 

Roll on the rugby season, I wish the players all stay safe and well, and the supporters too. 
Onward and Upwards C'mon Donny!
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Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by Trailfinder Trailfinder wrote:

Back to rugby... away at Pirates first up will have been the last fixture Saracens would have wanted but what pre season preparation will Pirates have? By then Saracens will have their Barbarians players back and 5 preseason games under their belt so will be firing. 

This is a good question, as far as I can see, the preparations that I am aware of are:

Ealing - 8 matches! (2xNewcastle, Saracens, Donacaster, Bristol A)

Saracens - 5 matches (2 x Ealing, Doncaster, 2 x Coventry)

Doncaster - 3 matches (2 x Ealing, 1 x Saracens)

Coventry - 2 x Saracens

Can anyone add to this?
 Coventry - 1 x Jersey (this weekend) and 2 x Saracens
 
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Originally posted by Whistle watcher Whistle watcher wrote:

Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by Trailfinder Trailfinder wrote:

Back to rugby... away at Pirates first up will have been the last fixture Saracens would have wanted but what pre season preparation will Pirates have? By then Saracens will have their Barbarians players back and 5 preseason games under their belt so will be firing. 

This is a good question, as far as I can see, the preparations that I am aware of are:

Ealing - 8 matches! (2xNewcastle, Saracens, Donacaster, Bristol A)

Saracens - 5 matches (2 x Ealing, Doncaster, 2 x Coventry)

Doncaster - 3 matches (2 x Ealing, 1 x Saracens)

Coventry - 2 x Saracens

Can anyone add to this?
 Coventry - 1 x Jersey (this weekend)

That was announced and quickly withdrawn from the website Rhys (unless you know different, I haven't seen it reinstated as yet?).
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Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Aaand... the Jersey match info has now been pulled from the Cov website.
So who knows?
I've removed it from my earlier post to avoid confusion - at my age I probably imagined it.
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By May, could we be in position for limited crowds (1,000?).

Supporters wearing masks, spread around grounds?
Old enough to know better...just wish I knew what
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Originally posted by kempstonblue kempstonblue wrote:

By May, could we be in position for limited crowds (1,000?).

Supporters wearing masks, spread around grounds?
Hah. That'd be a full crowd for some! Wink
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Originally posted by Kimbo Kimbo wrote:

Originally posted by Whistle watcher Whistle watcher wrote:

Originally posted by gerg_861 gerg_861 wrote:

Originally posted by Trailfinder Trailfinder wrote:

Back to rugby... away at Pirates first up will have been the last fixture Saracens would have wanted but what pre season preparation will Pirates have? By then Saracens will have their Barbarians players back and 5 preseason games under their belt so will be firing. 

This is a good question, as far as I can see, the preparations that I am aware of are:

Ealing - 8 matches! (2xNewcastle, Saracens, Donacaster, Bristol A)

Saracens - 5 matches (2 x Ealing, Doncaster, 2 x Coventry)

Doncaster - 3 matches (2 x Ealing, 1 x Saracens)

Coventry - 2 x Saracens

Can anyone add to this?
 Coventry - 1 x Jersey (this weekend)

That was announced and quickly withdrawn from the website Rhys (unless you know different, I haven't seen it reinstated as yet?).

Ohh.  My bad.  Apologies.
 
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Cov vs Jersey finally confirmed https://www.coventryrugby.co.uk/2021/02/11/jersey-reds-added-to-covs-pre-season-preparation/
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