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Clear Out - Event Date: 08 Feb 2021

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tulip View Drop Down
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    Posted: 08 Feb 2021 at 13:53
You have to be very careful clearing out a ruck. In the Ireland v Wales game Peter O'Mahoney was sent off. Wayne Barnes called "Its a clear out Nothing wrong Totally unavoidable ". 
Then it goes to T M O  and he sends O'Mahoney off. 
I don't disagree with that decision but I don't think the intent was there to harm an opponent and it spoiled a test match where both teams wanted to play what I call proper rugby 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WEvans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2021 at 14:16
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

You have to be very careful clearing out a ruck. In the Ireland v Wales game Peter O'Mahoney was sent off. Wayne Barnes called "Its a clear out Nothing wrong Totally unavoidable ". 
Then it goes to T M O  and he sends O'Mahoney off. 
I don't disagree with that decision but I don't think the intent was there to harm an opponent and it spoiled a test match where both teams wanted to play what I call proper rugby 

O'Mahony made absolutely no attempt to carry out a legal clear out. If you go in as he did you know you are likely to harm an opponent. He knew what he was doing and was quite rightly red carded.

I don't think it spoiled the match and even if it did that it wouldn't have mattered. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Camquin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2021 at 15:19
I thought it was a cracking match. The card may well have changed the result, but it in no way ruined the contest.
Seen from the side Wayne was on it did not look that bad - from the other side, it was a clear red. That is what the TMO is for - the AR was possibly too far away to see clearly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raider999 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2021 at 15:41
Originally posted by Camquin Camquin wrote:

I thought it was a cracking match. The card may well have changed the result, but it in no way ruined the contest.
Seen from the side Wayne was on it did not look that bad - from the other side, it was a clear red. That is what the TMO is for - the AR was possibly too far away to see clearly.


Agree with everything apart from your final comment - think you are being very kind to the AR who should have had a good view of the incident.
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tulip View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tulip Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb 2021 at 15:48
I think you are spot on Camquin but  I do think ARs as Raider says need to be a bit more proactive as regards this and especially Offside. 
That is definitely spoiling game
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote French Connection Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2021 at 09:33
The key factor was that he raised his left arm as he went in and struck the Welsh player with his forearm/elbow. That's a deliberate action with intent to cause damage. It was a clear red from the moment he did it - Barnes just didn't see the raised arm from where he was. If he'd kept his arm down and struck him with his shoulder he'd have gotten a yellow at worst.  O'Mahony knew all that as well.
With all the fuss around the Thompson/concussion case, the game and referees are on high alert and any actio9n like that is going to be automatic red from now on, and correctly so.
And it certainly didn't spoil what was an absolutely excellent rugby match - best game of international rugby in the northern hemisphere for a while.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldman1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2021 at 11:20
Some ideas to help(?) with the current head injury, and other  problems.
Firstly any player in the "tackle zone" who is not on their feet must immediately get up and move towards their own try-line. So allowing the ball to be played by a player on their feet. By immediately I use the definition my old training non-com used when in  the army, "Pretty f....ng fast".
Taking a player in the air - following an open play kick, or a free kick,  the player catching the ball must have at least one foot on the ground. no jump, no danger of been taken in the air.
Replacement of front rows after 60min. Revert to injury only replacements, any player replaced because of injury must miss the next two matches to recover.
Finally to help prevent head injury's the ball carrier cannot dip into the tackle, ie must continue to run in an upright stance.
These may or may not help, maybe lock-down has just got to me!
Stay safe.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bunkermentality Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2021 at 11:26
Originally posted by tulip tulip wrote:

I don't think the intent was there to harm an opponent
Many folk cite intent or lack of intent as a guide to the severity of foul play. Brian Moore posted on Twitter on Sunday the "World Rugby's notes of guidance for referees regarding foul play". "Intent" is not mentioned, rather the "degree of danger" is the measure
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rabbie Burns Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Feb 2021 at 13:05
I think it is like Fin Russell’s yellow, had he kept his foot on the floor no action but the fact that he raised his foot trip. So no raising the arm probably yellow raise the arm red
So many Christians not enough Lions
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